so what is up ladies and gentlemen welcome to the brandoncoin YouTube channel I hope everybody's doing great if you're new here um this is going to be uh visiting the CEO and talk well not visiting but just talking to him on the not a live stream but a recorded stream so this is the CEO of salad his name is Bob Mr Bob I actually have I just got in my Bob coin by the way from salad uh I will show that off at the end um but yeah how you doing Bob welcome I'm glad to have you I'm great thank you Brandon excited to be here and chat salad Bob coin and Brandon coin yeah yeah definitely I thought that was cool because I I made my channel name years ago and uh never intended it for it to be anything so when I see somebody else just stick their name in front of coin uh I'm like ah I can relate you know Bob coin Brandon coin we're all here uh bcoin in the house but um we're going to roll through a couple questions that a lot of people have on their minds um and if you do have a question that's not answered in this video please drop it down below in the comment section and maybe we can schedule another one of these in the future but um the big one is and a lot of people have been talking about it I've been talking about it coming in coming into the winter time uh we do want to run these Rigs and make sure they're running um more often especially if somebody's using them to offset some heating costs um and I had talked to you previously about uh the mining workload so so originally through the summertime basically the setup guides were you know turn off mining it's not worth it uh but now with the some of these newer coins out for example AO there's probably going to be more um this may not age well with time so obviously uh take the date into consideration when we are talking about coins um but you had said that you use a uh an application and a program uh inside of salad so whenever you enable mining um how does that work I guess I'll just hand over to you now yes so Min is actually how we got our start uh 31 and the CL almost 7 years now and Mining is and always will be a really important part of the salad infrastructure for a few reasons um but I'll I'll leave those on the side we can come back to them uh but to answer you a question how how do we handle mining how's it set up we've got um a few different miners that we've used in the past um primarily today it's it's nice hash if I'm not mistaken it's their Miner that we've been running as an executable um and we've also had a few different pools that we've used in the past um but moving forward the team's actually today only today worked to Port over our mining from an exe executable that runs within Windows to a containerized miner um that will actually run kind of more seamlessly with our existing infrastructure um we haven't yet benchmarked it so I can't tell you how that's going to compare in terms of its profitability for salad balance as an executable running natively in Windows versus within what we call solid Enterprise Linux that's our own kind of dro of Linux which runs all of these containerized workloads within cell we've got different runtime security and host intrusion detection kind of overhead that might eat away at that H rate slightly so we need to Benchmark that um but really what we're looking to move towards is essentially when you enable um containers or accept containers uh you can still opt out of mining we won't send you a mining container if you've opt it out as you put as you put it you me some of people might not want to run those miners CU you know you have to kind of counter the heat with air conditioning which just really adds to the bill winter it might make sense um so so that total at least in salad will still be effective um yeah we're looking to containerize the mining and and really as a business our focus is more on the traditional Cloud market and Servicing customers who need gpus for workloads like you know AI inference text to image or more recently perhaps more exciting molecular Dynamic simulations drug Discovery those sorts of customers those sorts of workloads are our bread and butter the mining for us you know we're never going to compete with individuals tuning their machines to to to overclocking and underclocking all over bolting um um so so we're never going to be the best option as a mining will play really they're focused on those different uh higher paying higher rewarding jobs that are servicing more traditional Cloud customers yeah okay well um yeah that that makes a lot of sense especially um by the way I didn't ask where you're at but here in the US you know we're we're entering into our winter um so even on my machines that aren't going to be getting workloads very often you know I have some of the less desirable gpus I'd still want them uh Mining and creating Heat at at close to the most optimal level obviously running uh a miner beside uh a platform is very difficult so for you guys to include it all in one is nice when I was down in Miami I talked to the nice hash booth and they said that their nice hash dockerized container file should help out and they were actually designing it for a lot of people requesting it for vast so it's nice that you guys are including it um and I'm hoping you know less moving Parts more cash rate more Revenue uh because here soon I'm going to be spreading all my machines throughout the house you know one in each of the closets and and turn them all the mining workloads on we'll definitely need to do a a winter setup uh how you know setup guide for uh um maximum efficiency to offset heating cost and and stuff like that because some of these cards especially those you know the 309s 409s they they put out a good amount of heat um so that that can be useful and um yeah so are you guys going to do is it going to be a whole new update I saw there was 1.6.6 today will there be a new update whenever the nice hash dockerized container uh gets implemented no update required for chefs this is all just a business logic uh change in our backend essentially how we distribute the minor and which operating system it it runs within is it containerized running inal like all of our other container jobs or is it you know running natively on on Windows um that's the big change there and no update required for chefs awesome and you know unintentionally I didn't even think about it that may fix a lot of the issues where people are having their Windows Defender nuking like T-Rex minor and stuff like that where it's running in an executable whereas now if it's served up in a what a I don't even remember the file extension but uh served up in a Docker file window Windows is doesn't even see it so then it should run even better uh especially for people getting into you know maybe they they've never done mining before um so yeah I think that that'll work out well um I guess uh you had touched on it there briefly but you said there is a seal salad um Linux platform um is that something that's going to be implemented into like a full Linux build I know it's exclusively on Windows right now or R running inside WSL in Windows yeah that that's exactly it yeah so we we've been working on cell for two and a half coming in 3 years now and essentially the way we take hetrogeneous Hardware because every one of our chefs has a different setup you know different Hardware different drivers different operating system um it's the way we kind of standardize the compute environment as best we can um is using wsl2 Windows subsystem for Linux and then running our own build which is what we call seal salad Enterprise Linux um within that that that VM um and then within that VM and that comes with all sorts of overhead that we run kind of we have our runtime security module and and host intrusion detection system uh and a few other kind of Frameworks that we run um and then within that environment is where we we actually power these different customer containers containerized workloads which can include any number of jobs from um from our bread and butter today which is text to image stable diff fusion um more recently the community might have seen some um really high utilization of the network there was a a large molecular Dynamic simulation a drug Discovery simulation running um that customer got about 40% of the way through that simulation making some tweaks and so we we expect another huge kind of batch job to saturate a lot of the the machines on the network soon um and all of those containers run within seal within sell Enterprise Linux and of course moving forward you know we're going to take those Miners and exactly as you point out one of the the large bits of friction is Windows Defender will flag every one of them as you know a Trojan malware a virus whatever it might be whatever it decides it is um when we move that minor over to um seal we won't have that problem so there'll be a lot less friction uh and it'll be a lot less scary for for those who are un to mining as you say yeah yeah definitely everybody gets scared when they see Windows everything's a Trojan or a virus nowadays um but I I meant to to touch on it um is there going to be or or you know is it in the future a dedicated uh Linux distribution of the you know the seal um where somebody could just flash it right onto their drive and not even you know basically cut windows out of the equation yeah great question we are actively asking questions now um doing our due diligence kind of the the proper um product management process understanding the market the potential there for a an entirely new build that would be uh a Linux image that we ship rather than you know the windows-based system that we have today which you know everything we've built is is wsl2 is a dependency we've built it for wsl2 so it's not trivial for us to go and build a Linux um equivalent to to the salad that exists today um mostly because of the security kind of that runtime security a lot of it is kind of built specifically for wsl2 in that environment um but we're actually actively doing our our homework now and having conversations and trying to understand how big of a market is there um on the supply side if we were to provide that that um solid image and you know which is compatible with with Linux um and open up a bunch more supply for us because we you know it's an interesting Dynamic being a Marketplace that we are um there are these moments like 2 and 1 half weeks ago where we were short some 350 490s um and then fast forward to where we are today where now we have in excess more than that in in 490s cuz this large customer batch job ran requested more resources that we had and then that came to an end and now we have this excess and so for those moments where we need to burst out our capacity and we offer you know higher reward rates than crypto mining um that's where I think a Linux build would really reduce the friction for people to to recognize hey I can jump over to salad just like protocol switching you would in the the crypto mining World um and and generate a bit more return while we have those container you know demand from those container jobs and uh Brandon I've got you to thank for for giving me some advice on that you were one of those conversations I had um and I also recognize you know if I can just pivoting slightly one of the things we could probably do a better job of is helping you guys the crypto mining Community actually recognize or at least provides some signal as to when we are short on Supply which translates to a Miner's perspective a chef's perspective is if I put my machine machine towards sell it there's a there's a you know High likelihood of 99% it's never 100% CU there might be a compatibility issue but there's a very high chance I get a job versus right now where we have an excessive Supply and and you know maybe there's a 60% chance you get a job because we don't have enough demand to match Supply so U you know we're thinking about a a dashboard or or a web page people can go to um to that description now we're kind of spitballing that internally oh okay well that that was actually rolling into a question I had further on into the conversation um but I was going to be asking if we uh were going to be you know as as the salad chefs was there going to be a dashboard or a website or you know a page where we could see if gpus were needed not needed just to give people a heads up if I connect this like you said there's a high likelihood that you'll get a job or if you know you go on there and you see this this gpu's way down here at the bottom and it's cold and there's a low percentage or it's not needed uh obviously if you connect it you'll be calculating um because that that seems to be one of the biggest struggles now people hook up their computer and they're like why am I calculating I just watched a YouTube video and Brandon was he was chopping at this many dollars a day and um so that that's been a struggle point for people and even me now there's been days where it's just like it's that's calculating I don't know um but it is it's it's uh one of those things you have to learn as as time goes cuz uh customers come on and they go off like you said yeah and and just one more point on that we we try our very best to build for the future state that we will end up in and the way we view ourselves is uh more of an AWS in the sense that we have a suite of different products and services so we have SGS which is our our uh people can opt into these high bandwidth jobs um that's for streaming services vpns are primarily our customer there um we have these transcription this transcription API that we've just launched we have the container engine and over the course of time you know we plan to have dozens if not 100 different Cloud products and services and on top of our supply we will actually stack these products where we can on top of each other um so that'll manifest from a suppliers perspective very differently to how it does today where it's kind of matched one to one with scce s container engine where if there is a customer are you know wanting a specific hardware setup and we have a node that meets a chef that meets that setup we will match them and it's kind of one to one um that's going to be very different fast for the top two or 3 years from now where kind of that probability dashboard we described may not make sense 2 or 3 years from now but I think we're recognizing you know this is something we can easily build now and either modify or deprecate in the future when it no longer makes sense so definitely something we're we're thinking about now so that we can do a better job um for you guys in terms of managing expectations on what to expect and when to expect um of what yeah yeah absolutely that's that's the hardest part coming from uh just transitioning from crypto mining to like compute based workloads everybody's used to connecting it and getting paid like right away uh so then you know it's like retraining all all these these my friends and you know people that watch the YouTube channel stuff like that uh they're like why is it not doing it but um obviously as time goes on everybody will gain the education on it there no doubt you'll be gaining more customers um and uh I didn't want to hold you up here forever so we'll we'll knock out probably the last like big heavy hitter question cuz everybody asks this um and it's got to do with the the little check box whenever you're installing salad and it asks about adult content and what does that entail because some people are worried about it um other people could care less uh I'm probably in the category that cares less if it's if it's 18 plus it doesn't matter to me if it runs on my system as long as it is legal and um and how's that handled yeah so that's that's where we draw the line as well we we we've had a lot of conversations internally about this you know as a infrastructure provider do we want to start curating the content that is allowed or the workload profile types that are allowed on our our uh platform and was a very slippy slope you get to the point where you know you're you're making um these curations based on your individual preferences morals whatever you might call it and so what we've ultimately arrived at is is it legal is it not illegal there there and and obviously that changes based on jurisdiction um so we based on the IP address of where a chef is um we have different kind of workloads primarily that that logic is based around adult content so I'll get to your question um in terms of where we distribute these different different workloads um but coming to your so so that's kind of the the business logic we use in terms of what customer we will support and what we won't support um in the US here in the US don't let the accent fool you I'm here in the US um yeah um that content is legal and and so one of the things I I can actually um give you a specific example here um one of our large customers maybe I won't name them by name but you can go to our website and see who they are we we got a big ban Banner around them um they're a big text to image platform that has put a huge amount of effort into um controlling and minimizing and discouraging and adding huge amounts of friction for or anything that is certainly illegal but also not safe for work but it is in theory possible and so stable def diffusion for example that is a text to image uh AI model and you can prompt it to generate anything basically and so it is out of our control um what someone is prompting and certainly out of our customers control what their users are prompting St able diff Fusion to generate and so kind of our business logic specifically for us when it comes to um the adult content opt in or opt out the filter we apply is is it possible in theory to to generate adult content with this workload and and if the answer is yes we mark it as um content okay so so the reality is 99 I mean I I don't know the percentage but the overwhelming majority of those stable diffusion workloads are fine but there's the potential there and so therefore we feel like you one of our our brand values is all truth no [ __ ] we want to be as transparent as possible if there's a chance that a chef is is their machine is being used to generate something's not safe for work um even if the customer is not explicitly in that industry we want to give people the the opportunity to opt out and you know how that translates to a chef is you're probably less likely to go get a workload cuz many of our workloads are text to image today from a variety of different customers um but instead you'll you'll get you know less workloads but maybe there'll be transcription workloads instead or there'll be molecular Dynamics workloads instead where there's not even the potential for that abuse yeah okay well that that's actually a even better explanation than I was imagining because I imagine that there's probably some you know not safe for work uh companies out there and they they need uh you know stuff handled too but if it's actually the text the um image stuff that yeah that and it can also get weird and wild um depending on what people put in there uh but yeah so okay that that's actually uh that's that's pretty good that's pretty good cuz some people have definitely taken it out of context and you know tried to stand on a high around um whereas you know I look at it as the fact that every other platform that I've seen out there doesn't talk about it they don't they don't give you a check mark box they don't let you you know what can you you you you know control um they just you put your systems up there and then people rent it and you don't know what they're doing um you can see stuff that's running maybe depending on the platform um so uh honestly just giving uh your chefs more more choice is not aad bad thing in my book uh because you know just the name of some of the big ones off the top of my head you know you got vast you got flux Edge you got Chlor out there um there's no options on there uh so who knows what's going on and what's running and and yeah yeah not to say that any of those are bad uh just different right but um okay well awesome I I think that that hammers out and that Nails out a lot of the the major stuff um there was there was a couple more small ones uh everybody in their brother asks you know like what's Your Number One customer can you talk about them um and you know what are they used for uh on your workload side I figure we'll get through some of these small ones and then we can we can we can call it a video yeah let let me I mean the big customer we have so he here you know you can join the dots with this uh they're are top 10 AI um website they're okay with us talking about them as a customer um civi you know they generate we generate some 10 million images per day primarily stable diffusion um increasingly flux with with those guys the flux model it's kind of a new text to image model um they're running in the thousands of gpus at any point in time as a customer um second largest well actually they're no longer the largest um but but second and thir very similar profile company that we don't you know we don't have permission to talk about um I think what we are starting to see on the horizon um and just a bit of context for this we're a workload agnostic platform right you can for the developers out there that understand this you can containerize any workload it could be a minor could be stable diff Fusion it could be you know a simulation whatever it might be um we've recently seen a couple of uh drug Discovery companies spin up thousands of gpus to run these um molecular Dynamics um and what they call free energy perations um simulations and they'll they'll run them across 2 3 4,000 gpus um the challenge with those jobs is that they're batch in nature they're finite in nature unlike civi where you know they're running these thousand plus gpus pretty consistently throughout the day they might scale up scale down as as their demand profile does but we can expect that to to kind of run consistently you know in perpetuity right let's hope um with these large molecular Dynamics these drug Discovery jobs they have incredible impulses of demand for gpus they'll last for you know 3,000 gpus not another one came in and asked for 100,000 uh cores CPU cores so it was about 6,000 machines they spun up um but they they don't last forever you know uh 12 24 36 72 hours you know eventually they they kind of come up and turn off as that leads certainly as we're smaller where we measure the active gpus in you know the low tens of thousands um that makes matching supply and demand challenging um and kind of what I described earlier in the call where we're over supplied right now with 490s but then one of these jobs will come online and thumbs up then we're under supplied right um so the nature of that workload makes it tough I think where we are looking to do a better job and um where we could make life easier for Miners and and Brandon you and I were talking about this earlier um if we can get to say 80% of the profitability uh that is listed on um hash rate.
No you you know close to that kind of theoretical Max um with this new containerized Miner um at that point it's kind of The Best of Both Worlds where as a minor you can run salad we will you know be achieving close to what you could achieve yourself tuning this thing but then you're also part of the network and as as soon as one of these customers comes in with either a batch priority or you know let's hope high priority job um that's when you can see those earning rates really um you know go up by a multiple but you need to be on the network to be in the running right and and yeah XP is is kind of one of those things that we put our thumb on the nail uh sorry thumb on the scale um to to hand out jobs to those chefs with higher XP first as as kind of a reward for that loyalty so um we're very unsophisticated today but we're we're getting better and and we know the end state that we want to work towards yeah yeah I think um uh probably here in the next few days I'm going to be turning mining workloads on so hopefully it'll only get better um and I'm going to be spreading out the I right now at my house I have about eight machines running uh but I'll spread them out throughout my house and turn mining workloads on so that way they'll be make making heat and hopefully making good Revenue all day long if we can hit even uh if it hit 80% of what you know the top coin on hash r.o was I would be a static I think most people would because I'd sacrifice that 20% to earn 200% whenever that that uh you know uh the stable diffusion workload came on or sometimes even more than 200% some of these uh I miss my my $5 a day 3090 jobs and every now and then they they do pop up there but they're like you said they're not for long um so I'd love to capitalize on those when I can and then it go back down to mining during the day especially since it's winter time now uh so you know we can make that extra heat and still make a little bit of money in in the meantime um but I was going to say before we get off here where are you based out of can you talk about that yeah I can talk about that so I got a Aussie accent um the company is based out of that's where we were founded it's where I was when when solid was founded when 2020 happened uh we all went fully remote and actually 3 years and change now um I live I've lived down in Puerto Rico which is where I am now oh okay very nice how do you like it down there love it it's great it's hot it's not great for mining but um but it's a great part of the world yeah I was going to say winter doesn't really start there for a while does it no never really comes to be honest Brandon we have kind of a wet and a dry season uh and that's about it yeah yeah over here I'm in the east coast I'm in North Carolina and um we've already been dipping down into the 40s at night so um it absolutely pains me to turn my heat on uh because I have electric heat so it burns a lot of power um and I'm like yep it's time to start moving stuff inside cuz all my mining stuff and all my AI stuff is in my garage so it doesn't help my my house any right now um so yeah I know a lot of a lot of viewers and stuff we have a lot of viewers that are Upstate you know Canada New York uh Washington stuff like that and um they kind of live and die by uh you know extra heat and stuff from miners I know there's a lot of people that keep old asex around um and run old asex for heat and I I meant to ask you this in the past um since you are plugged in on the nice and and stuff um do you guys run nice hash yourself or do you guys rent out and let people mine in their workloads to nice hash is that how how that works so like customers don't know the answer to that I'm not sure i' have to connect with the team obviously happy to give you that answer but I I'm not sure I I um you know it's been some time since I've really spent time and and been close to um what our infrastructure looks like for mining things I've been really focused on uh kind of the cloud market and how do we Define these new markets these new verticals of demand how do we find those customers how do we onboard them successfully um mining's not been top of mine for me so I'm I'm actually not sure of the answer to that question okay I know we use a few different pools um I I know nice has is one of them I know we use a handful of miners um but I haven't touched base my finger is not really on the pulse with that stuff right now no problem and um I guess to follow up the the little bit of a mining question there uh is it possible or you could probably ask your team if it's possible and maybe the you know running the dockerized image for nice has would help out with this uh is there a way to API to the widget and whenever you have mining enabled and you know you have a workload um and it gives you know that little readout of your estimated value is there a way to just put a whatever algorithm is beside it so if it was like on you know AO it' be whatever algorithm AO is or even just the coin uh just so like mentally we know oh it's on a mining workload not a uh a some kind of like compute workload because right now if you have mining enabled the only way I know that it's actually mining without opening like process manager or task manager is looking down and seeing a very low readout uh versus what it should be a higher one so it's still all like oh are we mining right now you know um I didn't know if that would be an option I think that would also ease some people's minds on uh CU then maybe they look down and they see it's a high value and it's oh it's not mining it's on a workload um or it's on a compute workload sorry I guess yeah I need to redefine that cuz mining can be also be a workload as well the the the earning rate's definitely oxy for that the indicator for that um I don't know I'd have to ask the team we we you know using WSL 2 it it's at the hyp ofisa level that we're kind of isolating this virtual machine and and um we do our best to keep them completely separate and independent so I uh but that said I mean we could always push it from that up to our what we call the Matrix and then back down kind of to to let the chef know what's what's running but um I'll L the team on on that one I don't think we can do it locally but it's not highly sensitive to latency that feedback anyway so definitely possible um it's just how it's implemented I'm I'm not entirely sure yeah that that wouldn't be information that needs to be like like any kind of like uh uh a low latency or low ping situation even even if it you know updated every few minutes um just to give people an idea like oh okay it's Mining and it's mining this uh for example or um if the M you know you could kind of do it if or you know if it's mining it's going to say what it's mining if it's not it's just not going to say anything you're just going to get a read out um but yeah so I I do really appreciate it and uh like I had said before speaking to the viewers right now if you do have a question and it wasn't answered or if you wanted to elaborate on that more uh we could always uh hopefully pick pick uh Bob coin's brain again on a future date and uh was there anything you wanted to wrap up with before we get off here no I think the only thing I would I would reiterate is that we um you know we've come to learn that that your community crypto miners are a really important part of um our Chef Community we've always traditionally been focused on um individual gamers uh but I think Min is certainly skew towards the more highend Hardware which is what our customers are are seeking so you know we're listening to you guys often we can be slow to implement you know the features you're asking for um but we're definitely listening and and kind of looking to further enhance the experience and the value we can deliver to you guys kind of in a partnership with you guys so um no this has been great Brandon Hope to come again come along uh from this again sometime in future yeah yeah definitely I appreciate it and um so ladies and gentlemen you guys have a good one we will see you on the sometime in the future adios
